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	<title>Comments on: Can Strategy Be Crowdsourced?</title>
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		<title>By: Uriah</title>
		<link>http://www.groupintel.com/2008/12/28/can-strategy-be-crowdsourced/comment-page-1/#comment-3597</link>
		<dc:creator>Uriah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Jan 2009 23:18:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.groupintel.com/?p=1146#comment-3597</guid>
		<description>Great post. To echo the upside of down, I&#039;d say you&#039;re making a strawman argument here in dismissing the ability of networks to develop strategy. I am by no means an expert well-versed in the important authors myself, but I was pretty against your arguments up until you began talking about hybrid systems. 

It would seem to me that the formation of a network dictates the abilities of that network. In being a part of an organization you make an informal agreement. The relative wisdom, or strategy that emerges from a given network will be dependent principally on that group&#039;s ability to independently recognize an effective strategy. For wisdom or strategy to the emerge, there has to be a critical mass of people within that group with both the ability to make good strategic decisions and to explain those decisions effectively to the remainder of the group. The point of the wisdom of the crowd is that within the sphere of action of a group, only the ideologically sticky concepts get enough momentum to emerge. The strategic effectiveness of a group is dependent on the intellectual resources available to it. Al Zarqawi had his own network of people who agreed with him that acted independently of the larger movement he was a part of. In that the more rational strategic arguments against his actions were not properly understood by his followers, and due to the extremely splintered lines of communication, the wisdom of the crowd broke down. There was not enough communication in their network-- in large part due to anti-insurgency efforts to specifically target al qaeda communications. It&#039;s not a fault of crowdsourcing-- it&#039;s a weakness of al qaeda network communication ability that was strategically exploited, and Zarqawi&#039;s massacres are the result of that exploit, which in turn shows how important freedom and security and comprehensiveness of communication and information is to effective action in general.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great post. To echo the upside of down, I&#8217;d say you&#8217;re making a strawman argument here in dismissing the ability of networks to develop strategy. I am by no means an expert well-versed in the important authors myself, but I was pretty against your arguments up until you began talking about hybrid systems. </p>
<p>It would seem to me that the formation of a network dictates the abilities of that network. In being a part of an organization you make an informal agreement. The relative wisdom, or strategy that emerges from a given network will be dependent principally on that group&#8217;s ability to independently recognize an effective strategy. For wisdom or strategy to the emerge, there has to be a critical mass of people within that group with both the ability to make good strategic decisions and to explain those decisions effectively to the remainder of the group. The point of the wisdom of the crowd is that within the sphere of action of a group, only the ideologically sticky concepts get enough momentum to emerge. The strategic effectiveness of a group is dependent on the intellectual resources available to it. Al Zarqawi had his own network of people who agreed with him that acted independently of the larger movement he was a part of. In that the more rational strategic arguments against his actions were not properly understood by his followers, and due to the extremely splintered lines of communication, the wisdom of the crowd broke down. There was not enough communication in their network&#8211; in large part due to anti-insurgency efforts to specifically target al qaeda communications. It&#8217;s not a fault of crowdsourcing&#8211; it&#8217;s a weakness of al qaeda network communication ability that was strategically exploited, and Zarqawi&#8217;s massacres are the result of that exploit, which in turn shows how important freedom and security and comprehensiveness of communication and information is to effective action in general.</p>
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		<title>By: networks, hierarchies, whether crowds can think, and how to stare down a mob&#8212;comments on Elkus&#8217;s &#8220;Can Strategy be Crowdsourced?&#8221; &#171; liber.rhetoricae</title>
		<link>http://www.groupintel.com/2008/12/28/can-strategy-be-crowdsourced/comment-page-1/#comment-3512</link>
		<dc:creator>networks, hierarchies, whether crowds can think, and how to stare down a mob&#8212;comments on Elkus&#8217;s &#8220;Can Strategy be Crowdsourced?&#8221; &#171; liber.rhetoricae</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Jan 2009 09:50:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.groupintel.com/?p=1146#comment-3512</guid>
		<description>[...] networks, hierarchies, whether crowds can think, and how to stare down a mob&#8212;comments on Elkus&#8217;s &#8220;Can Strategy be&#160;Crowdsourced?&#8221;  [...] &#8220;Most successful insurgent and terrorist networks are hybrid forms of network and hierarchal organization,&#8221; writes Adam Elkus in a series of free-form, stream-of-consciousness remarks available at www.groupintel.com and titled Can Strategy be Crowdsourced? [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] networks, hierarchies, whether crowds can think, and how to stare down a mob&#8212;comments on Elkus&#8217;s &#8220;Can Strategy be&nbsp;Crowdsourced?&#8221;  [...] &#8220;Most successful insurgent and terrorist networks are hybrid forms of network and hierarchal organization,&#8221; writes Adam Elkus in a series of free-form, stream-of-consciousness remarks available at <a href="http://www.groupintel.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.groupintel.com</a> and titled Can Strategy be Crowdsourced? [...]</p>
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		<title>By: The Tactical Loop &#171; The Committee of Public Safety</title>
		<link>http://www.groupintel.com/2008/12/28/can-strategy-be-crowdsourced/comment-page-1/#comment-3420</link>
		<dc:creator>The Tactical Loop &#171; The Committee of Public Safety</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Dec 2008 02:49:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.groupintel.com/?p=1146#comment-3420</guid>
		<description>[...] post On “Learning Organizations”. It covers many of the same themes as Adam Elkus&#8217;s post Can Strategy Be Crowdsourced? which I linked to earlier. Zen asks: Why would the “tactical” level have achieved “learning [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] post On “Learning Organizations”. It covers many of the same themes as Adam Elkus&#8217;s post Can Strategy Be Crowdsourced? which I linked to earlier. Zen asks: Why would the “tactical” level have achieved “learning [...]</p>
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		<title>By: the upside of down</title>
		<link>http://www.groupintel.com/2008/12/28/can-strategy-be-crowdsourced/comment-page-1/#comment-3410</link>
		<dc:creator>the upside of down</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Dec 2008 15:42:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.groupintel.com/?p=1146#comment-3410</guid>
		<description>Dude, firstly, I&#039;m agnostic on the emergent-centric theory of warfare, but I can see a few things wrong in your argument.

1. While I know you said networks lack strategic intent, I think you severely underplay the strategic consequences of networks/emergence. There is more to strategy and decision making than just intent. If you were more widely read in philosophy, particularly moral philosophy (rather than picking and choosing whatever is cool in the continental side of things), you might have known the various other areas, e.g. intent, actions, means, consequences, imperatives, emotionalism, etc. Colin Gray -- a Clausewitzian -- outlines a good contra-argument to your position for the inter-relationship of small wars and strategic consequences in &#039;Modern Strategy&#039; (chapter ten from memory, the one on small wars and terrorist strategy). 

2. I think you&#039;ve also created a strawman and nirvana fallacy of the emergent-sides argument. You&#039;ve stated &#039;in the long run&#039; these groups lack intelligence. Well that&#039;s all well and good, but there isn&#039;t a long run with these groups, and I believe others have already pointed this out. I don&#039;t really get where you are going with that argument. These aspects seem to be inherent to swarm intelligence applied to warfare: it&#039;s a short term hive mind that can create massive strategic consequences. Arquilla and Ronfedlt pointed out this stuff years ago with their &#039;pulsing&#039; strategies, and groups rapidly assembling and then leaving. These authors, and others who have focused on the networked style organisation (sageman, naim, kenney, et al), have also pointed out from the beginning of their writings that many of these groups have hybrid form organisations. I mean who exactly are you talking about here that are making these arguments? John Robb? It sounds like you comparing idealized arguments with the reality of what people are really saying, which is the nirvana fallacy. Can you identity exactly which writers you are talking about, and which organisations they claim are emergent?

3. Searle&#039;s argument was for AI and philosophy of mind. Pretty much nothing to do with crowd psychology. So your argument is a strawman. Crowds also have individuals in them. And once again, if you were familiar with the literature of crowd psychology (see hatfield, cacioppo, and rapson), then you&#039;d realise that there are thinking human beings in a swarm who can sync themselves up to the emotional contagion and drive crowds to some goal.  

4. The 4chan/anon example is also a strawman. You are comparing a bunch of prankster kids with a lack of resources who have a history of taking the piss, with military capability (and come to think of it hierarchal nation-states have also said they were going to destroy terrorist groups, and haven&#039;t yet, how does that factor into your necessary and sufficient condition of strategic intent?) 

5. I see your David Tucker naval-hierarchy argument, and raise you a Norman Dixon &#039;On the psychology of military incompetence&#039;. As someone who actually served in the military I can tell you that Dixon is mostly spot on. The people who spout off crap about hierarchy are mostly pogue colonels and their sergeant major lackeys who are so disjointed from what actually goes on that the hierarchal mindset allows them a measure of controlled chaos over their alternate view of battlefield reality (I have no doubt it is kinda like political administrations). In fact, don&#039;t even bother reading dixon&#039;s book, google the blog &#039;Fobbits need ice cream too&#039; for the military ground truth of the Iraq war. Same shit, different uniform it seems.

Anyway, I&#039;ve had enough of (somewhat) fisking this post.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dude, firstly, I&#8217;m agnostic on the emergent-centric theory of warfare, but I can see a few things wrong in your argument.</p>
<p>1. While I know you said networks lack strategic intent, I think you severely underplay the strategic consequences of networks/emergence. There is more to strategy and decision making than just intent. If you were more widely read in philosophy, particularly moral philosophy (rather than picking and choosing whatever is cool in the continental side of things), you might have known the various other areas, e.g. intent, actions, means, consequences, imperatives, emotionalism, etc. Colin Gray &#8212; a Clausewitzian &#8212; outlines a good contra-argument to your position for the inter-relationship of small wars and strategic consequences in &#8216;Modern Strategy&#8217; (chapter ten from memory, the one on small wars and terrorist strategy). </p>
<p>2. I think you&#8217;ve also created a strawman and nirvana fallacy of the emergent-sides argument. You&#8217;ve stated &#8216;in the long run&#8217; these groups lack intelligence. Well that&#8217;s all well and good, but there isn&#8217;t a long run with these groups, and I believe others have already pointed this out. I don&#8217;t really get where you are going with that argument. These aspects seem to be inherent to swarm intelligence applied to warfare: it&#8217;s a short term hive mind that can create massive strategic consequences. Arquilla and Ronfedlt pointed out this stuff years ago with their &#8216;pulsing&#8217; strategies, and groups rapidly assembling and then leaving. These authors, and others who have focused on the networked style organisation (sageman, naim, kenney, et al), have also pointed out from the beginning of their writings that many of these groups have hybrid form organisations. I mean who exactly are you talking about here that are making these arguments? John Robb? It sounds like you comparing idealized arguments with the reality of what people are really saying, which is the nirvana fallacy. Can you identity exactly which writers you are talking about, and which organisations they claim are emergent?</p>
<p>3. Searle&#8217;s argument was for AI and philosophy of mind. Pretty much nothing to do with crowd psychology. So your argument is a strawman. Crowds also have individuals in them. And once again, if you were familiar with the literature of crowd psychology (see hatfield, cacioppo, and rapson), then you&#8217;d realise that there are thinking human beings in a swarm who can sync themselves up to the emotional contagion and drive crowds to some goal.  </p>
<p>4. The 4chan/anon example is also a strawman. You are comparing a bunch of prankster kids with a lack of resources who have a history of taking the piss, with military capability (and come to think of it hierarchal nation-states have also said they were going to destroy terrorist groups, and haven&#8217;t yet, how does that factor into your necessary and sufficient condition of strategic intent?) </p>
<p>5. I see your David Tucker naval-hierarchy argument, and raise you a Norman Dixon &#8216;On the psychology of military incompetence&#8217;. As someone who actually served in the military I can tell you that Dixon is mostly spot on. The people who spout off crap about hierarchy are mostly pogue colonels and their sergeant major lackeys who are so disjointed from what actually goes on that the hierarchal mindset allows them a measure of controlled chaos over their alternate view of battlefield reality (I have no doubt it is kinda like political administrations). In fact, don&#8217;t even bother reading dixon&#8217;s book, google the blog &#8216;Fobbits need ice cream too&#8217; for the military ground truth of the Iraq war. Same shit, different uniform it seems.</p>
<p>Anyway, I&#8217;ve had enough of (somewhat) fisking this post.</p>
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		<title>By: Lexington Green</title>
		<link>http://www.groupintel.com/2008/12/28/can-strategy-be-crowdsourced/comment-page-1/#comment-3408</link>
		<dc:creator>Lexington Green</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Dec 2008 15:30:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.groupintel.com/?p=1146#comment-3408</guid>
		<description>Adam, this is very good.  
.
You wrote:
.
&quot;Counterterrorism analysts should also take care to avoid regarding all forms of hierarchy as inherently rigid. Even the most brittle hierarchal organizations often contain network forms with elastic lines of command and control. The German military, a highly hierarchal institution, embraced infiltration tactics led by decentralized hunter-killer teams on the tactical level.&quot;
.
You might have gone farther with this, using the German example as a starting point.  The dichotomoy which is the core of this article is a false one.  The great challenge is to have sufficient hierarchy that the organization is capable of having a goal, generating a strategy, and executing the strategy to achieve the goal, while at the same time retaining elements within the organization of resilience, adaptability, creatitivy, etc.  Otherwise, as we know, the hierarchic element in the organization can, be the source of brittleness that invites attack and causes failure.  This balance is very difficult to achieve.  The Germans did it by creating a shared ethos, through common training and careful personnel selection, which allowed freedom of action to lower levels of command, within a common understanding, and in the service of a common strategy.  Few organizations succeed at harmonizing these two disparate functions.  The Prusso-German officer corps, Lord Nelson&#039;s &quot;Band of Brothers&quot; and to a lesser extent the Grande Armee at the height of its power, demonstrated the combined characteristics of flexibility and decentralized rapid decision-making power, all in the service of an overarching, coherent strategy.
.
Merely flattening an organization, or saying it should be &quot;networked instead of hierarchical&quot; will not be good enough.  A perpetual balance must be struck.
.
Finally, I am not sure Clausewitz, were he miraculously brought back to life as a grown man, in our own time, would be a blogger.  I think that he would have been open to blogging, and other wonders of our age, as a way to convey his ideas and carry on conversations.  I think that he is would also be likely to get into uniform and get to &quot;where the action is&quot;.  Clausewitz as a battalion commander in Iraq is easy to imagine.  And after that experience, with his blog posts as part of his source material, he could give us a new edition of On War, encapsulting the last 200 years, and his current combat experience.  
.
Alas, it is not to be.  We will just have to do our best to bring his hardnosed, empirical spirit, with his lust to get to the bottom of things, to see things as they really are, to our own thinking on these issues.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Adam, this is very good.<br />
.<br />
You wrote:<br />
.<br />
&#8220;Counterterrorism analysts should also take care to avoid regarding all forms of hierarchy as inherently rigid. Even the most brittle hierarchal organizations often contain network forms with elastic lines of command and control. The German military, a highly hierarchal institution, embraced infiltration tactics led by decentralized hunter-killer teams on the tactical level.&#8221;<br />
.<br />
You might have gone farther with this, using the German example as a starting point.  The dichotomoy which is the core of this article is a false one.  The great challenge is to have sufficient hierarchy that the organization is capable of having a goal, generating a strategy, and executing the strategy to achieve the goal, while at the same time retaining elements within the organization of resilience, adaptability, creatitivy, etc.  Otherwise, as we know, the hierarchic element in the organization can, be the source of brittleness that invites attack and causes failure.  This balance is very difficult to achieve.  The Germans did it by creating a shared ethos, through common training and careful personnel selection, which allowed freedom of action to lower levels of command, within a common understanding, and in the service of a common strategy.  Few organizations succeed at harmonizing these two disparate functions.  The Prusso-German officer corps, Lord Nelson&#8217;s &#8220;Band of Brothers&#8221; and to a lesser extent the Grande Armee at the height of its power, demonstrated the combined characteristics of flexibility and decentralized rapid decision-making power, all in the service of an overarching, coherent strategy.<br />
.<br />
Merely flattening an organization, or saying it should be &#8220;networked instead of hierarchical&#8221; will not be good enough.  A perpetual balance must be struck.<br />
.<br />
Finally, I am not sure Clausewitz, were he miraculously brought back to life as a grown man, in our own time, would be a blogger.  I think that he would have been open to blogging, and other wonders of our age, as a way to convey his ideas and carry on conversations.  I think that he is would also be likely to get into uniform and get to &#8220;where the action is&#8221;.  Clausewitz as a battalion commander in Iraq is easy to imagine.  And after that experience, with his blog posts as part of his source material, he could give us a new edition of On War, encapsulting the last 200 years, and his current combat experience.<br />
.<br />
Alas, it is not to be.  We will just have to do our best to bring his hardnosed, empirical spirit, with his lust to get to the bottom of things, to see things as they really are, to our own thinking on these issues.</p>
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		<title>By: Aerodynamic Hierarchy &#171; The Committee of Public Safety</title>
		<link>http://www.groupintel.com/2008/12/28/can-strategy-be-crowdsourced/comment-page-1/#comment-3404</link>
		<dc:creator>Aerodynamic Hierarchy &#171; The Committee of Public Safety</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Dec 2008 06:18:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.groupintel.com/?p=1146#comment-3404</guid>
		<description>[...] leave a comment &#187;  Adam Elkus has an interesting article up: Can Strategy Be Crowdsourced? [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] leave a comment &raquo;  Adam Elkus has an interesting article up: Can Strategy Be Crowdsourced? [...]</p>
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